Info Favorites Register Log in
myArmoury.com Discussion Forums

Forum index Memberlist Usergroups Spotlight Topics Search
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Welded Tang? Reply to topic
This is a standard topic  
Author Message
Bryan W.





Joined: 27 Oct 2007

Posts: 198

PostPosted: Mon 15 Dec, 2008 3:01 pm    Post subject: Welded Tang?         Reply with quote

Apologies in advance for my sheer ignorance.

I've read in some places that a welded tang is often unreliable in durability, however I have noticed that some places that usually have decent reviews like Darkwood are selling these types of blades.

I was considering investigating the possibility of purchasing something from Darkwood and the reviews seem nice but can anyone comment on their welded tangs or have people been looking at blades from them that aren't fashioned in such a way?
View user's profile Send private message
Michael Pikula
Industry Professional



Location: Madison, WI
Joined: 07 Jun 2008

Posts: 411

PostPosted: Mon 15 Dec, 2008 3:13 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Normally it is best to avoid welded tangs if possible, but there are certain steels, like L6, that make a great blade, but can't be peened so it is necessary to weld an extension on so that it can be peened. If done properly there is no problem with a welded tang. Not knowing anything as to how Darkwood does their tangs I can't comment on them specifically, but thought I would offer feedback from a makers point of view.
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Nathan Robinson
myArmoury Admin


myArmoury Admin

PostPosted: Mon 15 Dec, 2008 3:17 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

If done properly, a welded tang can offer just as much strength as a solid tang. In fact, the weld can often be stronger than the alternative. I've not seen Darkwood's offerings in that area to comment specifically on their methodology, however.

-----

This does not answer your question, but I thought you might find it of interest as this stuff is related to the subject and might round out the knowledge-base:

Construction of early medieval swords

Construction method comparison

Modern vs. Period Tang Construction

Tang size: Behavior of narrow tangs

Why are western sword tangs so narrow?

.:. Visit my Collection Gallery :: View my Reading List :: View my Wish List :: See Pages I Like :: Find me on Facebook .:.
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Hadrian Coffin
Industry Professional



Location: Oxford, England
Joined: 03 Apr 2008

Posts: 398

PostPosted: Mon 15 Dec, 2008 7:05 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

By the way many originals especially viking blades had welded tangs. I believe Lutel also welds some of their tangs.
View user's profile Send private message Yahoo Messenger
D. Austin
Industry Professional



Location: Melbourne, Australia
Joined: 20 Sep 2007

Posts: 208

PostPosted: Mon 15 Dec, 2008 8:03 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

These days, a welded tang could be a sign of a manufacturer who finds it more cost effective to attach a thinner piece of steel to the blade stock (probably with a mig welder and possibly with a less than perfect weld) than to cut away that which is not to be part of the tang (thus losing steel) or to draw it out (time consuming). This can cause a weak point, particularly if it is welded cold, which is what I'd do if I wanted to cut corners. Whilst fine for a wall hanger, it's bad news for a practical sword.

A welded tang however, can be superior. A number of good knife makers will weld a mild steel tang to a carbon steel blade. This has a few benefits. A softer tang will absorb shock more easily and is also safer to peen. If forge welded properly, the join should not be a weak point in the construction.

I'm sure that the topics Nathan linked will more than explain it but thought I'd try to put it simply.

On the topic of Darkwood blades, I cannot comment as I have no experience with them, but it may be worth asking them how and why this is done.

Darren.
View user's profile Send private message
Dan P




Location: Massachusetts, USA
Joined: 28 Jun 2007

Posts: 208

PostPosted: Mon 15 Dec, 2008 8:32 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

My Darkwood Armory rapier has what I think is a welded tang. So far, this sword has held up to my clumsy flailing around and occasionally cutting light targets like cardboard, fruit, and bottles. Its definitely the most "functional" sword in my collection.

I also have a Hanwei Side Sword with the same type of welded tang constuction. I've not had a problem with mine but others have reported the weld appearing weak, breaking, or bending. Now I am a little reluctant to cut with it.

So... its a valid way to make a sword, but whether it makes a GOOD sword I guess depends a lot on how much effort the company puts into making a quality product.
View user's profile Send private message
Mikko Kuusirati




Location: Finland
Joined: 16 Nov 2004
Reading list: 13 books

Posts: 1,056

PostPosted: Tue 16 Dec, 2008 12:12 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hadrian Coffin wrote:
By the way many originals especially viking blades had welded tangs. I believe Lutel also welds some of their tangs.

I think Lutel weld pretty much all their tangs, actually. But they do it right - see here. No rat tails or spot welds. These are very sturdy and perfectly functional tangs, and very securely fixed, they just happen to be made of a different piece of steel than the blade.

The subtle tongue, the sophist guile, they fail when the broadswords sing;
Rush in and die, dogs -- I was a man before I was a king.
-- R. E. Howard, The Road of Kings
View user's profile Send private message
Jeroen Zuiderwijk
Industry Professional



Location: Netherlands
Joined: 11 Mar 2005

Spotlight topics: 2
Posts: 740

PostPosted: Tue 16 Dec, 2008 4:21 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hadrian Coffin wrote:
By the way many originals especially viking blades had welded tangs.
Can you support that? AFAIK there are a few rare examples, but those were broken and had a new tang attached. Forging the tang is much easier, and welding the tang on introduces the change of a weld flaw in exactly the most vulnerable spot of the blade. So it's no surprize if this wasn't the prefered construction method.
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Chad Arnow
myArmoury Team


myArmoury Team

PostPosted: Tue 16 Dec, 2008 5:43 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jeroen Zuiderwijk wrote:
Hadrian Coffin wrote:
By the way many originals especially viking blades had welded tangs.
Can you support that? AFAIK there are a few rare examples, but those were broken and had a new tang attached. Forging the tang is much easier, and welding the tang on introduces the change of a weld flaw in exactly the most vulnerable spot of the blade. So it's no surprize if this wasn't the prefered construction method.


Here's what Peter Johnsson said in one of the threads Nathan linked:

Quote:
It is not uncommon to see welded tangs.
Why this was done can be for several reasons. It might even have been made during original manufacture, where a softer extension is welded on to the blade, forming the end of the tang. Or it may have been made later in the life of the sword, either as a result of refurbishment in a culterīs shop or as a repair after having failed in use (an old weld coming apart, perhaps).


For what it's worth I've heard the same comment from others who have spent a great deal of time studying period originals.

Happy

ChadA

http://chadarnow.com/
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website


Display posts from previous:   
Forum Index > Historical Arms Talk > Welded Tang?
Page 1 of 1 Reply to topic
All times are GMT - 8 Hours

View previous topic :: View next topic
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum






All contents © Copyright 2003-2020 myArmoury.com — All rights reserved
Discussion forums powered by phpBB © The phpBB Group
Switch to the Basic Low-bandwidth Version of the forum