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J Anstey





Joined: 21 Jul 2007

Posts: 233

PostPosted: Tue 22 Jul, 2008 8:53 pm    Post subject: Patrick Barta price increase         Reply with quote

Hi there,

I am probably one year into my three year wait on a Templ sword, this was prior to the increase

You have probably all noticed a big price increase in his swords - justifiable I think as his work is so special and his demand is so high.

I know there are a few people here on his waiting list and wondering if those who got in line prior to the increase will be paying the old price or the new?

Many thanks

Jason
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Vaclav Homan




Location: Hradec, Czech
Joined: 22 Jan 2008

Posts: 90

PostPosted: Wed 23 Jul, 2008 9:38 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

In this year increase exchange rate in Czech more than 20 % . Czech crown is one of the world proliferate conversion.
In the fact, Barta donīt increase prices.

There is only one art of fence yet many ways to reach it
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Jeremy V. Krause




Location: Buffalo, NY.
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PostPosted: Wed 23 Jul, 2008 11:35 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I am fortunately going to pay the old price. It makes me kind of wish I would have discused two swords instead of one!!

I thought that his prices are in euros.

Jeremy
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Vaclav Homan




Location: Hradec, Czech
Joined: 22 Jan 2008

Posts: 90

PostPosted: Wed 23 Jul, 2008 12:35 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Czech is in EU but we have not Euro for the present. Exchange rate Euro and CZK is 22 % higher than for 5 month.
There is only one art of fence yet many ways to reach it
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J Anstey





Joined: 21 Jul 2007

Posts: 233

PostPosted: Wed 23 Jul, 2008 6:59 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi there

I think the price increase was more like 50% -

Jeremy, when is your sword due? and how did you find out that you would be paying the old price?

Many thanks

Jason
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Mike Capanelli




Location: Whitestone, NY
Joined: 04 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: Wed 23 Jul, 2008 8:39 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I'd be interested to know as well being about 2 yrs on his list.
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Jeremy V. Krause




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PostPosted: Wed 23 Jul, 2008 9:40 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi Guys,

Being that this will be the absolute crown of my collection and in some sense a realization of a dream historical specimen I have remained in contact with him. My order was placed nearly one and a half years before the increase.

I feel so lucky to be in my position as my price is so fair for the work involved. The type of detailed iron inlay involved, to my knowledge, has not been produced in any modern blades. I don't even know how he will do it, but I have all the confidence that he can.

Jeremy

but please understand that I do not want to speak for Mr. Barta. He alone provides his quotes.
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Stephen Curtin




Location: Cork, Ireland
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PostPosted: Thu 24 Jul, 2008 12:47 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi everyone. I have been a member for a while but this is my first post on the site anyway when exactly did this price
increase happen Id like to know cuz I placed an order with Mr. Barta about 2 months ago.
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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Thu 24 Jul, 2008 1:13 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Obviously, it's always best to go to the source and ask the smith (always). But, I'd be surprised if agreed-upon, confirmed orders would see a price increase. That would be almost a bait-and-switch situation.

So while Mr. Barta would be the best person to ask, it would be a horrible business practice to change the price for people who had already agreed on the price of a commission, made a deposit, and were in the queue. I would bet that if you'd agreed on a price and placed a confirmed order, that would be the price you would pay. Any increase should apply to future commissions.

I see it like Albion's future price increase and so many others we've seen in this industry. If you order before the increase, you pay the old price even if the item is completed after the price change takes effect. By placing your order before the increase you reserved the item at the price, regardless of what prices do later.

That said, I've been screwed when changing currencies was involved, as many others have. I placed an order with a European company who deals in Euros. My US Dollar lost a lot of value while I was waiting on the item. The price in Euros didn't change, but the value of my currency did. Their delays in finishing the item cost me an extra $50 or so because the dollar kept dropping. If it had been done on time, my dollar would have gone further as it hadn't started losing value at the time of the original promised delivery date. But they never changed their price.

Once a price is agreed on, it should remain that price regardless of other price increases. A custom commission is a contract and the terms shouldn't be changed after everything has been agreed on.

Happy

ChadA

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Jean Thibodeau




Location: Montreal,Quebec,Canada
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PostPosted: Thu 24 Jul, 2008 3:05 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Chad Arnow wrote:


So while Mr. Barta would be the best person to ask, it would be a horrible business practice to change the price for people who had already agreed on the price of a commission, made a deposit, and were in the queue. I would bet that if you'd agreed on a price and placed a confirmed order, that would be the price you would pay. Any increase should apply to future commissions.



If one had only reserved a place in the production cue but no specific design had been agreed about and no deposit given I could see where the price might be set at the later scale ? A case where the specifics of the design had been deferred in that the design would have been decided on when one's place in the cue came up ? Depends if the maker accepts commissions this way or not ? And I can see someone just saying to a maker that he can make what he wants when the project comes up.

There might even be a fixed budget agreed upon: Like $2000 maximum, but then after a price increase the same $2000 might mean a more modest project ? Just speculating about grey zones where what is fair might not be a black and white thing. Wink

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Chris Artman




Location: USA
Joined: 12 Apr 2008

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PostPosted: Thu 24 Jul, 2008 3:37 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I'm only 2 months in on the waiting list... but I suppose if there was an increase, I'm also in the waiting list at standard pricing. That being said, we have not yet actually picked a specific sword yet and left that to be determined since a lot can happen in a few years... I said we should pick when the time gets close... That seemed fine to him.
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Chad Arnow
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PostPosted: Thu 24 Jul, 2008 5:29 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

If you and the maker didn't agree on an item or price specifically, then you might very well be subject to any subsequent increases in prices. If you've just reserved a place in the queue, there's been no contract about pricing.

When I made my reply above, I was careful to say things like "agreed on a price", "confirmed", "made a deposit", etc... Happy I wouldn't get in a maker's queue without agreeing on all that, but that's just me. Happy

We can all speculate all we want here, but I'd encourage anyone with questions about their orders with a smith to contact the smith directly. Happy

Happy

ChadA

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J Anstey





Joined: 21 Jul 2007

Posts: 233

PostPosted: Thu 24 Jul, 2008 8:01 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

... for what its worth I think the prices went up around 6 months ago.

And Chad you are right it is all here say, I am just working out my budgets and it got me thinking about the increase.

Yes an increase of 400 Euros is quite a bit, but I believe that his work was very under priced before and possibly still is when you consider what some production company pieces cost.

It is up to Patrick to charge what he sees fit, he doesn't take deposits so I guess that I should budget on the higher and may be pleasantly surprised at the time. Either way I am not about to jump out of the queue.

THanks for all of the responses.

Cheers

Jason
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