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Jeremy V. Krause




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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 7:34 am    Post subject: @$%#&! I dropped my sword         Reply with quote

Yes I did- my second hand Duke,

It fell onto a dumbell (how appropriate) resulting in a medium sized nick with bent/rolled edge about 6 inches from the guard. It is probably about 1-2mm into the blade- not tiny and not catastophic. This is the first major accident resulting in significant sword damge in my 9-10 year hobby. I do not know if albion will be able to fix it as it will require some reshaping of the blade profile. When it happened I was more sad than angry. I had to tell myself "it's just a material thing- no big deal." But on the other hand it is kind of a big deal to me. Sad

How do others respond when a more significant "oops" happens especially to a higher end item I am not talking about the very superficial and easily fixed tiny dings.

Regarding the sword, I mean it still looks great I just can't help that feeling when I pick it up- it is kind of a voice saying over and over "Darn this thing is broken, darn this thing is broken, darn this. . . . "

Knowing that historical swords had such problems doesn't really address the issue for me because this is not a historical sword though it is a great reproduction.

Thanks for letting me air my feelings in the myArmoury support group!
Jeremy
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Michael S. Rivet





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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 7:47 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Oof. I feel your pain. It's easy to tell yourself "It's only a material thing" but the fact is that material things do matter sometimes because they have meaning to us that transcends the materials.

Only thing I can suggest is stop playing those tapes in your head that make you blame yourself. Yeah, it's got a mark on it. It got that mark because you were handling it which, in this case, is part of the reason you got it. And yeah, it was accidental damage, but that happens sometimes. Mainly what that mark on the blade says is "This is not a decoration; this is a sword. I got it to touch it, hold it and use it." It can be, in a way, part of what gives that "material thing" it's meaning.

(Legal disclaimer: Note that the verb "use" is not intended to imply using the sword as a weapon or, in fact, in any way that is unsafe or potentially hazardous for the wearer and/or other parties present. If unsure about whether handling a sword is safe, call the manufacturer. The writer of this message will not assume responsibility for anything, regardless of whether or not it is actually his fault.)
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Sean Flynt
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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 8:06 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Theoretically, if all the material is still there (i.e., rolled rather than chipped edge,) it can be moved back into place, right? You should certainly check with Albion for repair but if that's prohibitively expensive, you could try to do it yourself very carefully. I'm not suggesting that a cold repair would be good as new structurally, but it might be invisible.

Or, you could make a nice scabbard.

-Sean

"Everywhere I have searched for peace and nowhere found it, except in a corner with a book"- Thomas a Kempis (d. 1471)
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Jeremy V. Krause




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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 8:37 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks Sean and Michael,

When I am up to it I will sed it to Albion to see what they say. I'm really not handy at all when it comes to weapons particularly because I do not see exceptionally well. It is still fine for cutting and I may do some of this before I send it off. It is still attrative and one has to really look for the nick- well at least I do.

How have others handled damage to their blades? I guess I'm glad that I didn't get a new Duke- that would have made me more upset as the sword would have cost significantly more.

Jeremy
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George Davidson




Location: Glasgow Scotland
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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 10:02 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

dropped, fell over and bent/twisted the basket on my 4 day old schiavona ... that was 10 days ago.
That night visited one of my fencing class ... he later said I looked like I was ready to cry.
Still not over it although it is repairable ... hopefully soon!
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Jean Thibodeau




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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 12:25 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jeremy V. Krause wrote:
Thanks Sean and Michael,

When I am up to it I will send it to Albion to see what they say. I'm really not handy at all when it comes to weapons particularly because I do not see exceptionally well. It is still fine for cutting and I may do some of this before I send it off. It is still attractive and one has to really look for the nick- well at least I do.

How have others handled damage to their blades? I guess I'm glad that I didn't get a new Duke- that would have made me more upset as the sword would have cost significantly more.

Jeremy


About a month back I went to my first cutting session and managed to hit a nail in the top of the post holding the melon I was cutting with my Dordogne ( wrote a bit about it in another Topic ). The nail was there to hold the target melons or pumpkins on the top of the post. ( Note, the nail extended about an inch out of the wood, but a cut coming in a bit low hit the nail: I'm going to try to find a better way to hold the target fruit next time and will suggest it to my instructor for next time ).

O.K., now to get to the point: The " NICK " looked huge and upsetting until I got home to do something about it: When I did some spot resharpening the remains of the " NICK " is now a barely visible shallow depression on one side of the edge.

The raw damage always looks much worse than it is and a half a mm is barely visible when blended into the intact edges next to it. Also this didn't mean having to grind away 1/2 mm along the entire length of the edge.

If I didn't know it happened I wouldn't even notice the remaining nick and it is only obvious when I use my 8X loupe.

A lot depends on how confident you are about your sharpening skills if you want to do it yourself. If Albion does it for you only a very deep notch would be hard to completely greatly minimize or eliminate.

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Jeremy V. Krause




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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 12:49 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Thanks Jean,

Maybe it will be okay. I am incapable of posting pictures or else I would, both for everyone here and for the folks up in Wisconsin. I'll just have to see- I do believe that if I attempt to do it myself I will possibly or probably mess up the blade. I have never been especially good with touching up/sharpening of my albion's as I always end up sending them anyway in the end.

Much of my problem with sword maintenance is confidence but also that I don't have anyone around to bounce ideas of off and attend to the damage with someone in person who is knowlegeable and who sees better than I do .

Another thing- using a magnifying loup is the ONLY way I look at my swords up close because of my visual impairment. I know I would feel better if I could place the sword in a vice on a table in order to keep it stationary but I do not have this capability. Its' really quite annoying.

Jeremy
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Jean Thibodeau




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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 1:12 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Jeremy V. Krause wrote:
Thanks Jean,

Maybe it will be okay. I am incapable of posting pictures or else I would, both for everyone here and for the folks up in Wisconsin. I'll just have to see- I do believe that if I attempt to do it myself I will possibly or probably mess up the blade. I have never been especially good with touching up/sharpening of my albion's as I always end up sending them anyway in the end.

Much of my problem with sword maintenance is confidence but also that I don't have anyone around to bounce ideas of off and attend to the damage with someone in person who is knowledgeable and who sees better than I do .

Another thing- using a magnifying loup is the ONLY way I look at my swords up close because of my visual impairment. I know I would feel better if I could place the sword in a vice on a table in order to keep it stationary but I do not have this capability. Its' really quite annoying.

Jeremy


Glad if my comments helped and a very wide cutting sword has more meat that can be removed for occasional repairs and losing a millimetre or two in width would be hardly noticeable when done well. ( By Albion ).

A lot of these wide cutting swords must have become much less wide if heavily used and passed from generation to generation: Might have been an extra reason/advantage for making wide blades as it might make the useful life of a sword a bit longer. Also smoothed out nicks might make a blade that had seen frequent heavy use look a bit " wavy " and far from geometrically perfect but still very useable when the sword is perceived as a tool rather than as a precious object.

Only, very very deep and numerous nicks or gouges in a blade would be a functional problem.

You can easily give up your freedom. You have to fight hard to get it back!
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Felix R.




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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 1:46 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Something similar happened to my Albion Fiore shortly after I got it. I made some swings as a warm up and scratched the tip over concrete, the tip looked like it had been plained out for some square mm it it wasnīt that bad, I took a hone tried toīget back the rectangular point and finished it of with scotch pad, it isnīt 100% anymore but it is aservicable tip again. And of course, if seen as a working tool, there will be scratches over time.

Last edited by Felix R. on Tue 13 Nov, 2007 2:04 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Jeremy V. Krause




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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 1:57 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hi everone,

One thing that is annoying though is that I wasn't even "using" the sword. I had it placed atop a pew like piece of furniture and I went to get something off of the seat and bumped it and BLAMMO! the sword falls behind the pew and I'm thinking "OMG that thing didn't fall on anything I hope" but SNAP! there it is in ii's injured glory for all to see and admire. It will get a life time comments like "yeah it's nice but it looks like you dropped it. . . . . "

Jeremy
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Gary A. Chelette




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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 3:03 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

What ever happin'd to those test where they cut through a barrel and nary a scratch on the blade?
My bastard sword came to me with a nick in the tip of the blade and I just filed it out.
You'd never know it was there.
It was a Del Tin blade.

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Don't talk nonsense, man. I peed my kilt the first time I went into battle.
Oh, aye. Angus pees his kilt all the time!
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Jeroen Zuiderwijk
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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 3:53 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Just a few days ago, I drop one of my bronze leafblades. It landed with the point in the floor at an angle, and stuck about 1cm into the floor (vinyl over wood). The tip was slightly bend. But thankfully this is bronze, so a few hits with a wooden mallet, and the damage was gone Happy
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Anders Backlund




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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 5:02 pm    Post subject: Re: @$%#&! I dropped my sword         Reply with quote

Jeremy V. Krause wrote:

Regarding the sword, I mean it still looks great I just can't help that feeling when I pick it up- it is kind of a voice saying over and over "Darn this thing is broken, darn this thing is broken, darn this. . . . "


Nah. "Broken" is when the blade is actually snapped in two. Razz

Look, you have my sympathies, but if the sword is still functional, looks good and can be repaired, why not try to think of it as part of the sword's history? That this is a sword something has actually happened to? (It's not exactly "I damaged it dueling the Evil Marquis deMontalban!" or anything, but still.) In the end, you can't keep it brand new forever.
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Tony Brass





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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 7:34 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I know it is not an Albion, but I once dropped a Cold Steel Chinese War sword. The day I got it, I bumped it, it slid off of a 6ft high shelf, and fell blade first onto a steel tool box. Just took a chip right out of it. Oh, I agonozed. I filed and filed, until I could run a finger over the chip without feeling the damage on the side of the blade. Then I filed some more.

I lost enthusiasm for the sword. A month later I pulled it out. I had been doing some cutting on soem cardboard boxes with some more high end swords. The boxes were double walled and very heavy cardboard, but my viking blade was cutting deep into the cardboard (18 inches or so) with full power swings. The boxes balanced on a large ceramic pot.

I gave it a go with my damaged CS Chinese war sword. It went right through the whole box, about 36 inches, before I could stop the swing BANG, the blade hit the ceramic pot, and putting a new even larger chip in the blade. Back to the file. This thing either has a curse on it, or just the misfortune of a clumsy owner. Wierd but now I really enjoy the sword again. I feel almost liberated by the event. Pristine swords are pretty, but a drag to have to keep pristine.

I always think of a passage in the book [i]Purity of Blood[/i], where a gentleman in Madrid (circa 1600) meets up with the protagonist Capt. Altariste. The gentelman's sword is pristine, and when he sees Altariste's sword, with its rust marks, and scratches, he feels immediately intimidated. Fix it as best you can, but let it be imperfect.
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Nathan Keysor




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PostPosted: Tue 13 Nov, 2007 8:28 pm    Post subject:         Reply with quote

If it makes you feel better my Albion Crecy which I bought second hand came out of the box and stabbed a postal employee and also bent the tip a bit on its way to me. I was able to straighten it out and regrind it so it looks like new. I also managed to drop my Sovereign the day I got it so that the tip landed right on a 1/4" steel plate and bent. I haven't fixed that one yet. And that's all just this past month!
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Reinier van Noort





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PostPosted: Wed 14 Nov, 2007 12:53 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

A few weeks ago I was riding my bike home from practice with my pollaxe resting on my shoulder. When I rode underneath the apartment building I live in to stall my bike there, it hit the underside of the building, and one of the four claws on the head got bend. I tried to hammer it back into place but that didn't work; it must have hit really hard.

On the one hand I'm glad the topspike wasn't knocked off, or more damage was done. On the other hand I'm really sad....

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Norman McCormick





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PostPosted: Wed 14 Nov, 2007 4:00 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Having owned or handled many different types of antique arms and armour I consider signs of use, not to be confused with deliberate abuse, a positive attribute rather than a negative one. When I come across an unsharpened pristine 150 year old weapon it does nothing for me, all the weapon has done in its life is hang on a wall, sleep in a chest or take a turn or two around a parade ground. A weapon with signs of use has at least got an active history. Its like the guy whose workshop has rows of tools and machines that look like they have just been unwrapped, he has a history of good intentions but never actually achieved any of them. Many people go to extraordinary lengths to " ANTIQUE " new items for whatever reason, it might be an option for yours to give it an entirely new personality and put your mark on it . I do appreciate your disappointment, maybe anger, at damaging a pristine item but go out and have a swing at water bottles or what takes your fancy then pick up a hammer and file or whatever tool is necessary to repair minor damage and ask yourself is what I'm about to do going to change my life in any significant way whatever, the resounding answer is NO. Having been about for a while I know there is very little worth getting into a sweat over even less when the damage is already done, what is done cannot be undone, turn a negative into a positive have a go at a repair yourself and then pat yourself on the back at having completed a job well done. Whatever you decide to do I'm sure it will be the right choice for you.
Regards,
Norman.
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Reinier van Noort





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PostPosted: Wed 14 Nov, 2007 4:10 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I agree with the above sentiment, but to me there is a difference in damage occurring during, and as a consequence of, intended use, and damage caused outside of intended use. So the fact that I already have a bunch of creases and nicks in the langets from fighting with my pollaxe doesn't bother me at all (quite the contrary), but the bending of one of the teeth by not paying attention while transporting it does.
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Paul Watson




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PostPosted: Wed 14 Nov, 2007 10:05 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

I can understand frustration at damaging a weapon very early on in your ownership of it. Damage over time is also frustrating but the author of two posts above this one shares many of my sentiments.

Damage in use should be accepted as long as the damage is what can be reasonably expected and is not the result of sub standard manufacturing. If a sword is to remain in mint condition it needs to be handled very little and not "used" at all.

The tip of my Regent sustained some damage after it smacked into some concrete, about 1mm of the tip bent over like a hook. I simply filed it off, tidied it up and now the only person who can tell the difference is me and probably the maker. Instead of a needle sharp point it is slightly rounded (radius of less than 1/2mm), it needs very close inspection to even notice this. When it happened I was very angry with myself, but soon regained some common sense and just did the work to fix it.

My Knight also has some very minor edge damage from a botched hit that my brother in law performed. He actually hit the stand (and old tall wooden bar stool) instead of the target. The edge damage is minor for about 2cm along the edge and is only actually noticable to the touch (lightly running a finger on the edge)or if you are reflecting a light source on the edge of the blade. Where the damage has occured is the only point along the blade edge with enough surface area to actually reflect any light that is noticable to the naked eye.

Funnily enough just this past weekend I also hit the same stand twice with my Knight, trying to get as many cuts out of a couple of jugs as possible. There was no damage whatsoever to the blade, not even noticeable by touch in either instance which tells me the damage previously sustained must have been due to wrong edge alignment, because in the latest case the Knight sliced off a couple of peices of the top of this bar stool, so the contact was definitely significant and like I said no damage whatsoever.

I agree that any damage can be difficult to accept but if you can, it definitely becomes an interesting part of the character of the sword. My examples of damage have made no difference to the performace of either sword.

I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, but that which it protects. (Faramir, The Two Towers)
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Jeremy V. Krause




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PostPosted: Wed 14 Nov, 2007 10:23 am    Post subject:         Reply with quote

Hello everyone,

I am noticing a trend in posts that folks often feel better after they repair the damage they have caused on their weapons. THe problem with my situation is that I cannot or will not attempt to repair it myself and my conversations with Albion have not been really encouraging. So I am left in a limbo situation where I am not sure if this damage is repairable to the point where the damage would not longer exist or would be very difficult to see.

There is a difference between tip damage and blade damage 6-7 inches from the guard. I have even repaired tip damage on my Solingen. I do feel comfortable dealing with this type of damage. I really don't know what to expect from the nick I have caused. I don't know if it will be filed off leaving a tiny semicircle on the blade or whether the whole profile will need to be changed. It's the unknown which is annoying for me. If I knew it could be fixed it wouldn't be a big deal at all but like I said the conversation with Albion was not overwhelmingly hopeful. Sad

Jeremy
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